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71
Arma3 - Reviewed Missions / Re: [SP/CAMP] Underdogs (UNDER REVIEW)
« Last post by Undeceived on 11 Dec 2023, 00:30:07 »
I've come across some more issues I'd like to adress. The revive system had to be replaced (didn't work anymore) and some other things. I'll give my best to update the campaign this week. Sorry!
72
Arma3 - Reviewed Missions / Re: [SP/CAMP] Underdogs (UNDER REVIEW)
« Last post by Gruntage on 09 Dec 2023, 17:18:01 »
I'm fine with starting from the beginning as it will give me an opportunity to refresh my memory and discover more so don't worry about that.
73
Arma3 - Reviewed Missions / Re: [SP/CAMP] Underdogs (UNDER REVIEW)
« Last post by Undeceived on 09 Dec 2023, 15:57:24 »
Btw. I'm not sure what happens when you try to resume the updated campaign from this mission. As there are many variables passed forward etc. there could be some issues. That would rather speak for a new beginning. :D
74
Arma3 - Reviewed Missions / Re: [SP/CAMP] Underdogs (UNDER REVIEW)
« Last post by Undeceived on 09 Dec 2023, 15:54:08 »
As always, I am grateful for any feedback I can get. :good: And your criticism is very constructive anyway.

I rather wouldn't invest weeks though to realize such great ideas as it was the case in the BL thread. :D But small (and important) changes like this one are possible of course.

And fixing showstoppers of course.
75
Arma3 - Reviewed Missions / Re: [SP/CAMP] Underdogs (UNDER REVIEW)
« Last post by Gruntage on 09 Dec 2023, 15:45:13 »
I'm happy to wait for changes so take your time! By the way I'm nitpicky as hell so don't be disheartened by anything I've said here today.
76
Arma3 - Reviewed Missions / Re: [SP/CAMP] Underdogs (UNDER REVIEW)
« Last post by Undeceived on 09 Dec 2023, 15:41:00 »
Quote
if you had the mission fail because the player left the area without the crucial information, then that would solve that problem
I thought about this too. It's extreme but the mission is quite short so I think it would not hurt that much.

Quote
mixed messages
Point taken, good thought.

Will you wait until I update this or get on with it already? I hope I can update it until tomorrow or Monday.
77
Arma3 - Reviewed Missions / Re: [SP/CAMP] Underdogs (UNDER REVIEW)
« Last post by Gruntage on 09 Dec 2023, 15:34:27 »
Sorry I should point out that when I say an impossible objective I just mean impossible by means of stealth; I never had any issues clearing the station out rambo style  :D . I guess it wasn't clear whether stealth was the aim or not.
78
Arma3 - Reviewed Missions / Re: [SP/CAMP] Underdogs (UNDER REVIEW)
« Last post by Gruntage on 09 Dec 2023, 15:24:03 »
Ah ok, that does make things clearer. I assumed that, with how the campaign has allowed the player a lot of freedom when it comes to choices, this mission would continue in that way.

I think perhaps the issue here is an absence of information that would make your intentions as a mission maker crystal clear. This is probably an extreme way to do it, but if you had the mission fail because the player left the area without the crucial information, then that would solve that problem. You get across the idea that this objective has to be completed no matter what.

Also when you present the player with an instruction to leave because of impending danger, I think a lot of players would naturally leave. At that point, when on the one hand you have objective that must be completed AND you're telling the player to leave, you're essentially giving the player mixed messages. Silly people like me  :D will take those instructions literally especially if they're presented with what seems to be an impossible objective at first glance.

The solution to this problem is really just to remove any information that would lead to the player thinking that they have an avenue of retreat; don't give the player that option basically. Information just needs to be a little clearer.

But now that I know that the objective must be completed, then I can proceed. Whether you decide to go in and make some adjustments to this is up to you.

EDIT: There were a lot of documents lying around so it's possible I missed them.
79
Arma3 - Reviewed Missions / Re: [SP/CAMP] Underdogs (UNDER REVIEW)
« Last post by Undeceived on 09 Dec 2023, 15:18:53 »
This mission is very simple, there's no trick to it. Get in, get the docs, get out. The next mission then balances out the simplicity. :D
80
Arma3 - Reviewed Missions / Re: [SP/CAMP] Underdogs (UNDER REVIEW)
« Last post by Undeceived on 09 Dec 2023, 15:07:13 »
Thanks, Gruntage. It seems you've found a weak point in the campaign. In this mission the boys put everything on one card. Either now or never, as told in the cutscene or briefing (don't remember exactly where). Therefor you really have to search the station for information. But - I checked it - WHAT you search is indeed unclear (there are some documents on a desk in an office).

You can try to sneak in but it's very likely that they'll see you.

Regarding the ending: As they bet everything on that card (and thus the mission demands the finding of the documents), I'm not quite sure what to do when the player gets out of there because of the police reinforcements. I'm open for ideas here and I'd implement them. One example could be that I make it clearer that the task HAS TO be completed.
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