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Author Topic: (Review Completed) [SP] Darkness Before Dawn  (Read 12419 times)

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Offline DarkAngel

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(Review Completed) [SP] Darkness Before Dawn
« on: 19 Feb 2003, 14:13:55 »
Hi folks.

I've been checking out the OFPEC site for a while but this is my first shot at a decent, postable mission and I'm really keen to get it as good as possible, so all beta testing would be appreciated! It's a Black Ops mission set on Nogova with two objectives, the first to destroy a Shilka near the town and then to clear a communications facility up the top of the hill. Stealth is really important as there are a hell of a lot of Soviets in the area. You start off as a lone wolf and join your patrol later in the mission.

It's all created using Resistance v1.85 and no addons are used. It's quite a small ZIP (18.5k). Currently there is NO intro or outro, also no picture for the overview as I'm gonna use a shot from the intro. I'm looking for comments about gameplay, realism, bugs, really anything you guys can think of - all criticism is good as I'm pretty much a beginner!

Thanks folks.
DarkAngel


Edit: This mission has been reviewed and is available from the Missions Depot.
« Last Edit: 23 Dec 2009, 16:26:02 by Walter_E_Kurtz »
"Moondark" in Beta Testing

Offline macguba

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Re:Darkness Before Dawn
« Reply #1 on: 19 Feb 2003, 16:02:08 »
Hey, congratulations on your first mission DarkAngel!   :)

Don't have time to play it now but the download is ok and the mission starts fine.

Plenty of reviewed ArmA missions for you to play

Ace

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Re:Darkness Before Dawn
« Reply #2 on: 19 Feb 2003, 18:02:50 »
Yes I too have downloaded it but due to computer problems (this thing is running slower than my dead aunt Gladis!) I can't play it.

When everything is back to normal I'll give you some feedback.

 :)

Uberminch

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Re:Darkness Before Dawn
« Reply #3 on: 19 Feb 2003, 19:53:46 »
Now I'm no expert but it seems to me that this is a very good mission. It gets more interesting as it progresses, and it has (i think so anyway) a good amount of challenge.

However, there were a few things. I think you should expand the breifing a bit. Special Ops breifings, i think, need more information on enemy positions, situation, and details like enemy awareness. It seemed a little like i was just tossed in by the collar. Include some recon photos of key enemy positions, maybe, and add more about the circumstances in which the mission takes place.

Second, I think the Shilka was well placed. The boats patrolling off shore was a cool touch. However, I would take out the BMP patrolling the penninsula road and put in more soldiers instead. I think it would be more realistic considering the short scale of the road and the small width of the area.

Third, and not so important, I would reconsider the insertion point. It seemed a little....frank. Plop, there you are, right on the beach. The insertion must have been by boat, I assumed, and with Russian boats patrolling off shore with huge searchlights it would be hard to sneak in in that short amount of time and small space. Maybe it's not as important, but I would suggest starting further up near the main land.

Fourth, the tanks come after you when you are sighted. It don't think, though, that they would send their heaviest armor out if they spotted a couple of Black Op soldiers. They would probably send several patrols or Spetz Naz out to hunt them down. Maybe have a couple of truckloads of troops come out and look for you, or a mechanized infantry group.


Other than that, it looked really good. Again, like I said, i'm no expert. But this is my opinion. :D

Offline macguba

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Re:Darkness Before Dawn
« Reply #4 on: 19 Feb 2003, 20:24:32 »
I'll write this as I go along.

Briefing.    Make the Plan slightly longer:   put the Objectives on the first page and then link to one or two other pages for the background (which is very well written btw.)    The link to the RV in the Notes section doesn't work.    What is the significance of the red shaded area on the map?   The Briefing should indicate whether you are going to lead or be a member of the squad.    It should also tell you the composition of the squad, since you don't get it in Gear.

How did I arrive at the insertion point?   I would suggest a boat disappearing into the darkness, timed so that just as it disappears the patrol boat arrives.  They shouldn't meet though.

If you're after realism then this phase shouldn't be done alone.    I would suggest that the whole squad lands togther:  you and one other move (of course it should really be a 4 man team) off to do the Shilka, while the others patrol quietly and successfully to the RV.

No green tick when the Shilka goes, though I did get some titletext.   In fact I got no green ticks at all, so that needs looking into.   (The problem is in briefing.htm, the objectives are not numbered.)

Make your hillpatrols smaller:   it makes them harder to detect and more fun to take on if you see them.   With 9 loons there you aren't going to shoot - it's very hard to drop 9 before one of them drops you, if only because you'll probably have to change mags.

You need to make it clearer in the Briefing what has to be blown up at the Comms centre.    I placed a satchel between the building and the tent and got lucky, but you should mention that the critical stuff is the computer equipment in the tent.

Lose the fire at the exfil point, its unnecessary since you have the boat there to identify the place.   Make the trigger area smaller so that you get a little closer.      Link the trigger to the player (F2 drag and drop) otherwise you can complete the exfil by sending one of your loons over there.

All this stuff is just nit-picking, overall this mission is great.   Couple of other thoughts:-

I would consider an outro or ending cutscene (I know they are a real bore to make) showing the choppers landing successfully.  It would help with the sense of achievement.

The RV base is no good, its far too substantial for the circumstances.     If you want to have one lose the fire and make the ammo crates specific to the mission, i.e. you can't pick up any new weapons or anything, just replace ammo that you have used.   Better still would be to have no base at all:   have 4 men land from the boat, one going with you to the Shilka and the other two heading off to do a recce.     They would "check out" the Comms base and when you met they would report some stuff like the number of sentries or the fact that the computer equipment was in the tent next to the building.

Timing is I think a little tight:   30 minutes does not give you enough time to do proper recces of the targets or to move tactically across the ground.    I did it with 5 minutes to spare, but only by relying on savegames (which I use a lot when beta testing)

There is no medical treatment available for the player.    I would suggest that one of the squad is a medic, or if that creates addon problems make a little script to fake a medic at the RV.   Alternatively have a hospital at the Comms base, or halfway along the road from the Shilka to the town.    (To be fair I'm just sore because I had to crawl most of the way to the exfil ....)

No bugs.   Realism ... well each task would have taken a 4 man team who would have been inserted one or two nights previous to the assault.  

Oh yes, tanks .... well once I was halfway up the hill I wasn't bothered by them because I knew they couldn't follow me, at least not in time to be relevant.   I would be much more concerned by a couple of Spetz Natz teams in UAZs.    Also, if you happened to have a battle in the middle it would be virtually impossible to meet the deadline.

Now that I've read Uberminch's opinion I'd agree with everything he said except that I'd leave the insertion point where it is.  He is right, it is a bit direct, but I hate long boring marches in so in the interests of fun gameplay I'd leave it.

If you want to improve replayability put placement radii on the patrols' waypoints.

Excellent first mission.   Well done.
« Last Edit: 19 Feb 2003, 22:23:51 by macguba »
Plenty of reviewed ArmA missions for you to play

Offline macguba

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Re:Darkness Before Dawn
« Reply #5 on: 20 Feb 2003, 10:19:41 »
Another quick thought:   have the time reminders at 20 minutes to go, then 10, 5, 3, 2, 1.     The increasing frequency will add to the tension.
Plenty of reviewed ArmA missions for you to play

Offline DarkAngel

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Re:Darkness Before Dawn
« Reply #6 on: 20 Feb 2003, 14:02:00 »
Thanks for your comments guys.

You both mentioned the tanks, which I have to admit were a bit of a last minute addition to the mission. I'll get rid of them and put in some ground troops, or maybe scramble a Hind carrying a few SpetzNatz. That would be good as it would make escaping in the BRDM at the comm centre a little trickier. Uberminch, I think you're right about the BMP, it doesn't really do all that much anyway, apart from add to the atmosphere. Maybe a few more troops at the gate would do it better.

The briefing definitely needs expanding - i should have pointed out in the original post that it was really a stopgap until I work out the full thing. Definitely a more detailed report on enemy dispositions, maybe some pics (I need to figure out how to do this in HTML, i'll check out a tutorial.). I'll also do something about the insertion point. And try out MacGuba's suggestion about having a guy with you to do the Shilka. I'll also give a little more time, a few more (smaller) patrols, and things should be dandy  ;D

Thanks a lot for all your comments, I'll take them on board and get a second beta up soon.



"Moondark" in Beta Testing

Offline DarkAngel

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Re:Darkness Before Dawn
« Reply #7 on: 22 Feb 2003, 02:09:55 »
Hi guys.

Have been reworking the mission according to your comments and it's coming along v well. Unfortunately though I've run into a snafu doing the briefing. I've redesigned it so that the Objectives are on the first page of the plan, but you can link to further information re intel, mission plan and political situation. All these links work fine but when you link back the Objectives are nowhere to be seen?!  >:( Does anybody know why this happens? I've attached the briefing as a .txt file so it'll need to be converted again and renamed, sorry. :'(

Cheers
DarkAngel
"Moondark" in Beta Testing

Offline dmakatra

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Re:Darkness Before Dawn
« Reply #8 on: 22 Feb 2003, 12:04:54 »
just a quick hint here before I test and download the mission:

There are a black op medic addon at the addons depot

asmodeus

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Re:Darkness Before Dawn
« Reply #9 on: 22 Feb 2003, 12:27:48 »
Quote
All these links work fine but when you link back the Objectives are nowhere to be seen?!

This happens due to a bug in OFP.  

The way around it is to link to the notes page, then from there back to the briefing and then the objectives will still be there...   ::)  (sometimes you just have to roll w/ the punches)   ;)

Asmo

Offline dmakatra

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Re:Darkness Before Dawn
« Reply #10 on: 22 Feb 2003, 12:38:39 »
Ok, hereÂ's my report.

I read the breifing. Avarge, you should add some more stuff to it. Also, let me at least be a captain, not this sergeant shit.

So I proceeded. Walk up to da fence and when I saw da guard in front of me I stoped. I just stood there. Scared. Then the guard proceeded and I fast run out into the water and continued my journey. I walked, saw a boat, ran up just to be almost detected by a BMP. I threw myself down. When the BMP stopped at the camp I walk slowly into the camp from the right. My strategy was to take out the shilka with my only LAW, cause I got 1 LAW and 2 satchels and then make a go for it. I heard some russian voices, threw myself down and prepared myself for a fight. There was no fight. I tried to shot down the crew cause weird or not weird, it was only them who reacted by my discover. I couldnÂ't get a clear shot and I just let them go. Very dumb. In that range it looked like soldiers but when I heard that noice when you turned the tower I was really scared.
Anyway, I advanced, took out a guard and suddenly the shilka was in front of me! I havnÂ't seen it! I saw that it was active but it didnÂ't c me so I put a satchel and ran away. Just as I was to press da button I was shot by the fuckin shilka!

TOTAL:
This is a great mission so far. I donÂ't like special ops missions normally but this rox so far. IÂ'll give it some more tries and when I complete the mission I get back here for a full report. Good job! Looking forward to full version.

EDIT:
One more thing. You havnÂ't included the overview picture in the zip file so I cant c the picture.
« Last Edit: 22 Feb 2003, 12:41:32 by The real Armstrong »

Offline dmakatra

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Re:Darkness Before Dawn
« Reply #11 on: 22 Feb 2003, 13:26:20 »
Ok, so now IÂ've played the whole thing. Good job!

I started and this time I tried to blow up the Shilka from a very big distance. I did that. The escape was rather easier this time witch it should be cause I didnÂ't close in on the base. Sure, they shot behind me but they didnÂ't hit cause I hit the dirt and crawled the way.

I headed for the forest and suddenly a patrol walked just a couple of meters ahead of me! weapons armed and the whole thing. I threw myself down and I breathe fast and loudly cause IÂ've made the fast-run if you c what I mean ;D. After about 30 sec they put their gun on their back and started to walk after each other, regrouping just beside my head! Several guys just 5 meters in front of me looked at my head but didnÂ't c me. I embrased the dark and thought for myself "Praise BIS for their dumb AI! I hope they dont upgrade that in OFP 2 ;D".

I ran, and when I was just outside the forest a patrol shot at me, then just wandered away after I regrouped with my team and IÂ've ordered them to hold fire. Strange.

When I saw the base I thought "I am never gonna enter that camp without been discovered". I tried several times with different weapons to enter the camp but I always got shot down and the alarm raised. Then I came up with the brilliant idea to throw in a grenade in da tent, sure, the alarm would be raised but I would at least take out the whole base and my only worry would be the reinforcements. So I did. The alarm didnt raised!

I didnÂ't know where to satchel so I took the radio at the fire and the tent. Orderded my men to enter the BRDM or what do you call it but 3 didnÂ't wanna enter so he drove the truck. Why didnÂ't he wanna enter? check that up.

When I came to extraction point it just ended. Boooooooring. You must do a outro.

TOTAL:
The mission itself is great! The only thing you should work on is the intro witch you must have, the outro witch you must have, the breifing and the overview cause you dont include da picture in da zip. Great job! You made me like a special ops mission and that is very impressive!

Offline macguba

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Re:Darkness Before Dawn
« Reply #12 on: 22 Feb 2003, 16:04:57 »
You don't need to worry about a link back to the objectives page because the player can get back there anyway with the Plan tab at the top of the page.
Plenty of reviewed ArmA missions for you to play

Offline DarkAngel

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Re:Darkness Before Dawn
« Reply #13 on: 24 Feb 2003, 09:57:14 »
Hi guys.

Here's the Beta-2 version of Darkness Before Dawn with the following modifications:

- expanded briefing with working links (thanks Asmo and MacGuba)
- medical support added with a hospital in the town (am so far keeping addons out but may drop in a black op medic for the final version)
- BMP removed and replaced by more infantry
- scripted AI at the Shilka site
- patrol waypoints given placement radii and timeouts for replayability
- tanks at the comm centre replaced by a rapid response team
- more realistic insertion - whole squad infils together then splits to seperate tasks at the objectives.
- recon section has intel on the secondary objective

Known issues:
- no pic for overview
- no intro or outro yet - i still need to sit down and script the darn things

cheers for all your comments. hope you enjoy the new version - a final post should be ready soon.

DarkAngel
"Moondark" in Beta Testing

Offline dmakatra

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Re:Darkness Before Dawn
« Reply #14 on: 25 Feb 2003, 19:44:46 »
was there tanks at comm center? I avoid things best when I dont know of them ;D