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Author Topic: Music Licensing/restrictions  (Read 3495 times)

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john_clark

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Music Licensing/restrictions
« on: 08 Aug 2005, 11:11:40 »
I am not really sure where to put this, but does anyone know if thee are any restrictions on the music that can be used for missions?

Offline nominesine

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Re:Music Licensing/restrictions
« Reply #1 on: 08 Aug 2005, 12:21:47 »
In theory, yes, there are legal limitations.

In practice, no, thereÂ's no limit (reach for the sky).

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Offline Killswitch

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Re:Music Licensing/restrictions
« Reply #2 on: 08 Aug 2005, 13:04:01 »
There are definitely restrictions to distributing music, as you most likely know. Including music in OFP missions is no exception.

I would look into finding music covered by a suitable Creative Commons license, perhaps starting here.

Offline rado1265

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Re:Music Licensing/restrictions
« Reply #3 on: 09 Aug 2005, 16:37:24 »
Hm, I have the intention to use the music from other game.  This could be a bit "dangerous", eh?

Offline rado1265

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Re:Music Licensing/restrictions
« Reply #4 on: 10 Aug 2005, 19:14:07 »
No really, I have an issue here; I want to use the music from the other game in my mission.  The product is protected by EULA, but I have sometimes enough problems to understand plain English, not yet legal terms and language!  But as I can understand it, it says: don't tuch anything.

The game I have the intention to (ab)use is Freelancer from Microsoft (yes, I know! :P).  I remember Charlie Howarth has used some of the music files from this game in his excellent Apache Assault, but since then he's wanished from OFP community.  Maybe Bill gets him  :gunman:

I really need an advice or opinion from some smarter than me regarding this; I don't want any legal problems because of it.  So, what do you think; use or not to use?

Offline 456820

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Re:Music Licensing/restrictions
« Reply #5 on: 10 Aug 2005, 19:56:38 »
all i know is that you are aloud a certain amount of time of one thing like a limit

you cant use any more the x number of seconds of a song if you go over this limit and dont pay then you can be sued but if you keep in the limit its fine

im not sure how long this limit is though

bored_onion

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Re:Music Licensing/restrictions
« Reply #6 on: 10 Aug 2005, 20:37:05 »
this question crops up now and again and the message from the mod team is usually that using music from another game in missions is BAD - unless you have permission, which is GOOD. the law is, im sure, very difficult to pin down on this. my advice would just be to be careful and try and gain some kind of permission. if not, royalty free music is always good.

i made a thread about this kind of stuff a while ago, which has a lot of this kind of discussion in it and may also be of some use in clarifying issues:

http://www.ofpec.com/yabbse/index.php?board=9;action=display;threadid=19330;start=0

Offline nominesine

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Re:Music Licensing/restrictions
« Reply #7 on: 10 Aug 2005, 21:32:43 »
In real life I work for a quite large publishing company. We produce texts (itÂ's a news paper company) but the copyright laws are exactly the same as for music (and they are very similar through out the EU the USA and the rest of the western hemisphere).

This is how it works (simplified version)...

Music, text and pictures are created by someone, hence they are considered to be a form of "expression" and therefore they are to be protected in two ways.

1) If I write a text, then I own the rights of my expression (itÂ's a freedom of thougt thingy).

2) But since I work for a publishing company that paid me to write my text (i.e they gave me time and money to express myself) this company has copyrights to my text. That is, they controll the commercial value of the text as it was first published, but they are not allowed to change or modify the content (only I may do that).

Now letÂ's say, for sake of argument, that Karantan steals one of my texts and publishes it as part of the briefing in his mission. In theory I can then call an expensive lawyer and ask him to write a letter that ends with the phrase: "See you in court Karantan".

In court I would then claim that Karantan has damaged my reputation, by using my text (and hence my right to express myself freely) in a context that I never intended.

My publisher could also, in theory, make legal claims at the same time. He would claim that Karantan has made him lose money.

In theory Karantan could then be forced to give up most of what he has made, in money, from this theft and hand it over to me and my publisher. ThatÂ's it.

But, and this is the important part, It will never happen. The main reason is that IÂ'm not the only one who has a right to express myself. Karantans equally expensive lawyer would then claim that Karantan used my text as a paraphrase, to make a statement about the times we live in. I would lose that case. The only one that would benefit would be Karantans and my lawyers.

My publisher donÂ't give a single solitary f*ck about my right to express myself, but he does like money. And thatÂ's why he would never hire a lawyer to get Karantans OFP missions of the Internet. Unless, of course, Karantans mission became very, very famous and started to bring in large sums of money.

So, the reason I say it is safe is because no publisher in their right mind is ever going to leap into legal action against a bunch of teenagers playing computer games.

Post Scriptum: ... and to avoid misunderstandings, I think the copyright system is good. And if someone ever want's to use my texts, or scripts or whatever to make the OFP community a better place, feel free to do so. Rules and Windows are made to be broken and I promise I wont press charges. But please, please, please donÂ't use my texts in a way that make me look pro-american

 ;D
« Last Edit: 10 Aug 2005, 21:35:06 by nominesine »
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bored_onion

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Re:Music Licensing/restrictions
« Reply #8 on: 10 Aug 2005, 23:04:54 »
very nicely put and i agree - but it is easy to understand the position of the moderators

Offline Sui

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Re:Music Licensing/restrictions
« Reply #9 on: 11 Aug 2005, 02:57:08 »
The official position of OFPEC:

As I stated in the thread that bored_onion linked to, if asked we have to remove material deemed to be in breach of copyright. As a non-profit (or negative profit, depending on which staff member you're talking to ;D) site, we simply don't have the resources to pursue any sort of legal action.

As to the wider question of whether you're safe or not posting copywritten music on 'the internet'... that's a stickier and much more complicated issue ;)

Offline rado1265

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Re:Music Licensing/restrictions
« Reply #10 on: 11 Aug 2005, 15:36:15 »
Thank you all for your replies.  My main concern was related, or directed to the violation of copyright laws and author rights, and to the unauthorised distribution of such material.  And as maybe we all know, the Microsoft Company knows no mercy regarding such things, so I will not take any risk, especially because I mess with the files.

Thanks again, guys, you've further opened my eyes, and help me to make a final decision, though I anticipated-feared such activity might be illegal.

Well*sigh*, it looks like I am-we are sticked to the OFP music regarding this matter.  But that not bothers me one bit.  Never did.

Offline 456820

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Re:Music Licensing/restrictions
« Reply #11 on: 11 Aug 2005, 19:02:46 »
so you would be able to get away if you extracted some sounds from a different game and used them in an ofp mission

oh and also what company will actually care enough to call a loyer over a few guys playing ofp with their sounds were not making any money and if we do bis have rights to sue us since i read somewhere we cannot sell anything used to create something from Bis ? (is that right)

bored_onion

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Re:Music Licensing/restrictions
« Reply #12 on: 11 Aug 2005, 19:45:45 »
you would indeed be on seriously dodgy ground if you tried to release a mission or expansion pack for OFP which brought in revenue without the permission of BIS.

as for using other games' sounds, i think its pretty clear from what Sui says that OFPEC will always remove missions when asked to for copyright reasons. as a mission editor, it's up to you to ensure that your mission isn't one of the ones which is pulled and this means using your intuition. certainly, it doesn't seem likely that a company would ever get too stressed over a few sounds (i think i'm right in saying that ECP 1.085 took some from Call of Duty - and they're really cool :o) but in such circumstances OFPEC would always capitulate, as Sui has told us repeatedly.

Offline rado1265

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Re:Music Licensing/restrictions
« Reply #13 on: 11 Aug 2005, 20:04:23 »
Hm, maybe is time for a second thouth ... Hell, that Apache Assault is still on the Missions Depot!  And not long ago I played the mission with Metallica in it!

Maybe I'll even try to ask for the permision ...

As they say in my country: the fear has big eyes (and pants full of shit - my adding).

Dubieman

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Re:Music Licensing/restrictions
« Reply #14 on: 13 Aug 2005, 15:52:47 »
When have you ever used a whole soundtrack?

I do plan to use some custom music in future missions, but I'm not using all 3:21 or 2:45 min of it. Generally good practice is to keep battle music down and most cutscenes are not 2 minutes long.


Quote
ECP 1.085 took some from Call of Duty
You'd be surprised at what other sounds are not specific to their games. Most notably, the sounds ripped from Doom and Doom2 are everywhere in our commercials. :P