(Review Completed) [SP] Abandoned Armies

[Pilot]

I decide to head east to Sainte Louis.  But along the way, I come to a group of houses and a presumably empty fuelstation.  I decide to divert to La Trinite, and see if I can't find some sort of mine to place on the road going through this roadstop.  As I enter La Trinite, I find a northern convoy is just leaving.  After the convoy leaves, I run into the town, over to the ammo crates, I pick up the mines, and run back out.  I move to the roadstop, and place three mines on the road. I then take position on a hill to the south to view the results of the mines.  I start to move out, thinking the convoy wasn't coming.  I think I put the mines on the wrong road for the convoy .  Just as I was moving out, a jeep patrol came in.  But they didn't set off the mines?!  wtf?!  I thought the mines would destroy any land vehicle?  And I would be surpirsed if the three jeeps missed the three mines I put on the road, as I put them right in the middle of it!  Ok, I travel east to Saint Louis.  I crawl into the town to ckeck for guards before I start laying mines.  As I am searching, I hear two or three explosions, and the sound of a vehicle blowing up.  Then suddenly I get the message of them fighting each other!  Oh shit!  It's raining, the fog is coming in, they're fighting each other, and I'm in the middle of a Saint Louis in a small bush !  I'm not sure what made them start to fight each other.  I didn't attack anyone in La Trinite, and I haven't killed anyone in Saint Louis. I think it has to do with the mines I placed, but I'm not sure how that would get them fighting.  I decide to lay the last of my mines, and get the hell out of Dodge.  I can hear gunfire, grenades, and the occasional Vulcan cannon around nearby.  A convoy comes right past me, and the vulcan destroys something.  It gets tense for a few moments, but the convoy soon moves on.  I keep running west to get to my men.  The weather worsens.  I hear an RPG hit a vehicle and destroy it, awfully close to my position.  I run some more, another vehicle is destroyed.  I finally make it back to my men.  Current game time: It's the 10th, at 1:50 p.m.  I am considering waiting here until the storm passes, and ckecking out the airfield when it does.

[THobson]

@GI-YO
Well the only other time something like this happened Stamenov was killed by the northron attack group.  That should not happen in the next version.

repetion of the shots of the sea in between takes

The sea!! say more.  I did not plan on it showing shots of the sea.

Glad you liked it.

Progress report
The scripts I use to join up groups and to manage the endgame are now very much improved.  I tested it by creating a solitary loon way across the island from the base and made it the player.  I used a radio to kill the leader.  After a while I was joined to a group and ordered all over the place, I stayed put, but nothing I did could prevent me from ending up in the base.

Also, it is now not necessary to kill every loon, when they get down to a small number of living loons the northron survivors surrender, and the southron survivors run away (well some might also surrender depending on where they are).

Also if you turn up to collect the civis in a vehicle that does not have the capacity to carry them they will not get in.


EDIT:
@Student Pilot
We were posting at the same time.  The mines that did not explode - were these my mines or standard OFP mines?  Mine should detonate when a jeep passes, but the standard ones won't.

I am not sure I can figure out what started the war in your case.  Killing or disabling all the vehicles in a convoy will do it, as will killing or disabling the lead vehicle near La Trinite.  I have not had a case of the war starting on its own for months now - but if the war starts and the player doesn't know why then it might as well have been spontaneous.  Could it be that some of the southron guard units were following you and you led them into the northron's area?  If so that is magic.  I have tried for ages to get that to happen but never managed it.

[Pilot]

The mines that did not explode - were these my mines or standard OFP mines?

They were your mines.

Could it be that some of the southron guard units were following you and you led them into the northron's area?

This might be the case.  After I had gone to my position on the hill, I decided to go back down and lay the rest of my mines.  While I was doing this, I was killed, as I accidently had the sound muted at that time, I'm not sure if I was shot, or if I blundered into an already set mine (I think I was shot, as I was quite careful about not stepping on the mines I placed).  My retry point was back on the hill, so I retried, and moved back down the hill to place more mines, this time the sound was up, and I was shot.  The next time I waited in the bushes until the jeep convoy passed, then moved out.  My best guess is that when I moved out, a few men might have followed me, and engaged the convoy.

[THobson]

@Student Pilot
I don't recall having any problems with the mines before.  I will see if anyone else has had.

The next time I waited in the bushes until the jeep convoy passed, then moved out.  My best guess is that when I moved out, a few men might have followed me, and engaged the convoy.

From my (the builder's) point of view this would be neat.  It is a pity it is a puzzle to the player.

@ALL
Thoughts on the start (building on the idea that the island is something to be experienced not rushed):
At an early stage of developing this mission I had Alexi starting in Le Port and the only form of transport he could find there was a bicycle.  The only reason I changed this is that the dawn looks so wonderful I wanted to have him travelling east during the early stages of the game (and then I go and make a mistake of giving you all access to NVGs at Vigny!) .  Anyway - I probably won't go back to a Le Port start but I just wanted to see if any of you have views on the idea.

[macguba]

My old mission Lookout! had the player travelling west in the early morning for the opposite reason:   I wanted the player not to see the dawn until the end, when it suddenly appeared as you completed the last objective on a little hilltop and turned round.   The mission was timed so I knew what time the player would get there.    

It worked quite well, though I don't think anybody noticed.      The whole mission was in fact a study on light in OFP ..... as if anybody cared.  

Anyway, your fundamental principle is correct - keep it slow at the start, to build the suspense.     The problem with the pistol and the hill was that you felt nothing was happening:  this would not be the case with a bicycle.    I like the bicycle idea because you rarely get the chance to use one, and when you do you normally turn it down.     Encouraging the player to use one is unusual and therefore good.    

Not for Le Port to Vigny though, that's too far.    

Oh, and another thing I forget to post ages ago.   Cd44.   The landing beach in Vigny fjord.   That is the obvious place to leave your boat if you know the island and want to land secretly.      The climb up is hideous, but that's good.   The original climb was merely tedoius, this is actively difficult so you feel something is happening.   Then you meet the unmarked fence.     By the time you get to the village you are in a thoroughly bad mood, which is just how you would really feel.   The loss of 4x is not so keenly felt because it doesn't make much difference anyway.    

Better still start in Vigny fjord in the boat.    

There's no harm in using a default OFP boat - its not that unrealistic under the circumstances, plus people understand that one of the biggest mistakes BIS made was not to include a dinghy as a default unit.    The Soviet one is probably better for this mission.

Returning to the bike, landing at the pier at Bb63 is attractive.     Nearby place two bikes, a fire and a couple of bottles.     It is a long way to Vigny though, all uphill, and there's the garrison at La Pessagne to be considered.    Maybe motorbikes.    

[XCess]

I know you want to keep addons to a minimum but after Mac's suggestion the KLR popped into my head. It would have bneeen so usefull to have a few of them dotted around the map.

[THobson]

I had Le Port in mind because it would then be necessary to negotiate Chapoi and there also would be excellent chances of the player bumping into the Stamenov's convoy and/or the MG jeep patrol.  Being on your own in the dark, rain and fog and suddenly having the convoy appear and thunder past is quite an experience.  It becomes even more of an experiance if they happen to see you!

The burnt out house at Fh70 was to be the first stop where I would meet a little old man huddled by a fire who would not be my uncle but who would direct me to Vigny.  Trouble was the building cannot be entered ( and at that time I had not discovered the joys of General Barron's Editor upgrade).  So a west coast start it became.

My current version has taken the other extreme.  Starting point just over the brow of the hill from Vigny.  A couple of steps and you can see the building.

That is a neat landing point at Cd44.

The lack of a civi boat is a problem - I just couldn't bring myself to use one of the military ones,  I had no idea how on earth could I explain it

EDIT:

XCess I just saw your post:

What is a KLR?

and yes I am a bit fanatical about not using add-ons.

[macguba]

The lack of a civi boat is a problem - I just couldn't bring myself to use one of the military ones,  I had no idea how on earth could I explain it

You don't.    Just give it 3/4 fuel (to simulate the journey, it has to be more than half since you are planning on getting back) and bit of damage and little or no ammo, not that that really matters.    

We all know you have to compromise a little in OFP and in this particular case we also know that all kinds of wild and strange things are happening on the island.   A slightly odd boat is nothing.

The alternative - no boat - also looks odd.    So its all a question of what is the least worst option.   My vote is a Soviet boat.

When running around the little pier place, I did consider suggesting a ruin with an old fisherman, who you knew at least by reputation as somebody who might help you.    I didn't mention it because it means a whole extra cutscene, and right at the start of the mission.    But if you're willing to consider that anyway .....

Fh70 is ok as a house - he cann snuggle down between the wall and the building - but the location is too exposed.   It's also too far away.   With no 4x, and needing to be a bit tactical, it could take you the best part of an hour to get to Vigny and that really is too long.

Starting right on top of Vigny is also no good, you need the space.    

When stuck, return to first principles.....

There are three plausible islands for where you are living.   The bare island where the intro is shot; lighthouse island immediately to its south, and island point 15 south of Kassalon (as I call the Desert Island shaped isand).     All on the east side.    Kassalon and Airstrip Island would both be inhabited by marauding bands of soldiers.   The other islands are little more than rocks.

Let us assume that it is obvious that the main airport is going to be thick with soldiers and let us also assume that you have a suspicion of lots of soldiers in the main towns in the south.

Because it is shorter, and avoids the airport, you will come round the south of the Malden.   Your possible landing areas are:

- La Riviere jetty, particularly if you are short of boat fuel and think it would be safe to go there.  Or maybe south of Cancon but its a long way to Vigny and dangerous.

- the southern tip of the SW peninsula, though only if you know you can get transport at the lighthousekeepers' cottages

- the jetty, where there are facilities for boats and possibly an old fisherman.  Or the beach around there.

- Vigny fjord if you have the bottle to get in

Most of the western side of Malden is rocky and very open to weather from the west and is not suitable either for landing or leaving your boat on a filthy night.  

I think you should start on the shore near the boat, for realism reasons.  (Or in the boat.)

The other alternative of course is that fuel is very short and you land on the east coast in the Dourdan/Houdan area and go straight across the island via Arudy.  

Or use the Cessna somehow.

[Dubieman]

KLR is a Kawasaki KLR250. Dual sport/enduro motorcycle. Pretty fun to use in OFP, but I don't think its appropriate.    The Kawasakis are old anyways, we need some Suzuki DR-400 SMs! ;D

@ the bicycle: I used it for one of my mad rushes down the hill from the lodge to La Trinite. Very scary, but fun. It was good too, cause I could waste the bicycle to grab a better vehicle. Making my squaddies drive & follow me with enemies all about is too hard.

I believed you rowboat story, but maybe say you landed and when checking the shore it drifted off because of the darkness and rough seas.

@start: keep it where it is. Le port is too much. You'd run into the big convoys to fast. Dealing with jeeps at first isn't too bad. (best to ram them with your trusty PV3S ;D) But if you encounter M2A2s, vulcans, and truckloads of troops....too much. :-\

@way back on previous page: Malden is the smallest island? I don't think so. I thought it went desert island, everon, kolgujev, malden, and nogova. (smallest to biggest)

[macguba]

Malden is the biggest of the original islands.   IIRC it has nearly twice as many objects as Everon.

[GI-YO]

@thobson

The shots of the sea were in between the other shots showing the destroyed building and villages etc. The camera was stationary and the sea bobbed up and down a bit. looks like what happened when i tryed to do a scripted cutscene, camera doesnt appear to have any target. And at the end it zoomed (real fast) across the sea and went to a blackout. Possibly becasue of the way it ended for me. And on the debrief screen my mission time was 4 minutes. I think i broke your mission  

GI-YO

[THobson]

Malden is the biggest of the original islands.  

Okay I got that wrong.  When choosing the islands small size was one requirement.  Another was the ability to have two circular road patrols - one for each side.  I forgot I had to give up on the first to get the second.

I need to think about (I guess I mean come to terms with) using a military boat.

The shots of the sea were in between the other shots showing the destroyed building and villages etc. The camera was stationary and the sea bobbed up and down a bit. looks like what happened when i tryed to do a scripted cutscene, camera doesnt appear to have any target. And at the end it zoomed (real fast) across the sea and went to a blackout. Possibly becasue of the way it ended for me. And on the debrief screen my mission time was 4 minutes. I think i broke your mission

Gee it certainly sounds like it.

You can't believe the mission time at the debrief screen anyway.  I start the start time in init.sqs (it makes de-bugging easier to have the mission editor set to day time).  Also at the end scene I jump time to midday.  But 4 minutes does seem a little strange.

EDIT:

The other alternative of course is that fuel is very short and you land on the east coast in the Dourdan/Houdan area and go straight across the island via Arudy.  

I am now quite taken with the idea of eastward movement early in the mission.

[Pilot]

Ok, after a flight lesson this morning, I am back at it. (Flying and OFP, Lord, I am truly blessed! ;D)

I decide to start making my way slowly to Larche.  I stop in a bush nearby, and wait for the weather to clear some more.  A tree near me falls, although I don't see the vehicle that did it.  By this time the sky has cleared, but the fog is still here.  Suddenly I hear tank guns go off!  Several rounds hit somewhere ahead of me, and a vehicle explodes.  More guns, a vulcan joins in (or a shilka), another vehicle explodes, and I can't see a thing!  More heavy weapons fire, soon small arms fire joins in, and some grenades.  More vehicles explode.  Everthing goes quite.  Then more tank guns and a Vulcan shilka?) chimes in.  Must be the counter-attack.  More sporadic fire.  After awhile, the helicopter joins in.  The fog has lifted a lot, but not enough to see the results of the still sporadic battle, and I am not moving from my bush until I can see what's going on.  Finally I decide to move to another bush, then another.  I crawl into the town, and find a fuel truck, a repair truck, and a damaged Jeep MG.  I kill the two guards, and take the repair truck.  I hide it in some trees nearby.  I intend to use it to repair the disabled T80 up on the mountain.  After a bit of waiting, I decide the remaining helicopter flying around is a bit annoying.  I climb up the mountain to the lodge, take an AA launcher, and destroy the cobra :gunman:.  I pick up my RPG launcher, and head back to my men.  Tomorrow, I intend to clear Larche again (if there are any troops there), and repair the T80.  From here I am not too sure what I will do, I am still deciding.  Current game time: It's still the 10th, at 3:10 pm.  The sky is clear, but the fog is still there, limiting my vision to somewhere around 500 meters.

(If I am putting too much detail in my account, please tell me, I can shorten it if you like)

[THobson]

Not too much detail at all.
 
First it is fun to read.

Second it gives me useful information that is leading to changes in some of the game logic.  The weather you know about.  One of your previous posts sent me rescripting one particular feature, your post above has prompted me to check, and possibly change, something else.

Third I think you are the only person to start the war somewhere other than La Trinite.  Yours is quite unique experience so knowing all about it will be really helpful.

Keep at it and thanks for taking the time to write it all. ;D

[GI-YO]

Well i've found out who is killing Stamanov. A T-72 and a Abrams. They hit chapoi from the east just as I get there and they blow me up real good. Seems like this is going to be harder than the RPG vs Many tanks battle I had earlier.

GI-YO

EDIT - I killed Stamanov at range with HEAT shell and I got that same outro which is not the right one, so I don't know what i've done wrong. But this has only happened once and I always seem to break things so maybe it's just me......Cant wait for version 2. keep up the good work!

(review wordcount - 3303). Thats more than most the coursework i ever did