Author Topic: Is the Radio really that worthless in MP missions ? (Read 2710 times)

Wiper · « **on:** 09 Sep 2002, 02:28:32 »

Hi Folks !

Is it just me or is the radio really almost(!) useless in MP missions ? :-\

- First of all there seems no way to determine which side uses the radio in a multi sided MP mission.
- In addition it looks like there is simply one radio existent for all players/sides - the one on the server.

The latter means each <SetRadioMsg> changement shows up on all machines.
So no chance to get one of these multi page/multi menu scripts working in MP missions (on different sides).
The former means the latter is subsequent since it is not possible to give the radio a side specific usage in MP missions...the <side> command cannot "suppress" trigger action for a specific side so the action is executed on all sides.

Did not find any MP mission yet which uses the radio in a way like it is possible in SP missions.

Does really no one need to call in for arty support, shell rounds, area fire, target fire - individually on each side of course?
Really no one who needs to move multiple AI squads to specific locations on each side in a MP game ??

.. do i miss somefink ?

thx for any reply
ww

Sui · « **Reply #1 on:** 09 Sep 2002, 06:37:17 »

Just for the record... I have never used any radio commands in the MP maps I've made...

That doesn't mean it's useless however...

For a start, if you make all playable units group leaders (in other words, don't group them to anything) then everyone will have access to the radio (If that's what you want).

Also, you can use the command:

1 setradiomsg "null"

to effectively "turn off" the radio for specific players.
eg. if a guy you didn't want using the radio was called aP3 you could use (in a script):

? player == aP3: 1 setradiomsg "null"

And he wouldn't be able to use radio Alpha, while everyone else still would.

It can be hard to juggle... but the radio isn't completely useless in MP

Dinger · « **Reply #2 on:** 09 Sep 2002, 08:04:56 »

Yeah, true enough:
trigger activation is global, but scripts are painfully local. So you can solve the problem by ahving local scripting set to null the radio messages.
In any case, many of the actions that can be done via radio message are better done via action menu stuff. (even better: 1.75 dialogues).
Moreover, you've still got MP problems to deal with.

Take, for example, MP Artillery:
A. There's the problem of setting the plot. Most Artillery programs use usermarker routines. THat won't work in Mp.
B. Okay, so assume it's a preplanned suppression mission. All you do is make a radio alpha trigger and insert some fancy coding to make it visible to one side, still:
C. There's that whole camcreate thing. If you instruct only one client to camcreate a shell, the other players will see the flash and hear the screams of the dying, but won't hear the whistling of the shell or the sound of its explosion. If you instruct all clients to camcreate a shell, you've just unleashed weapon whose power varies according to the nmber of connected users.

My solution? uh, I use my artillery script and ignore the lack of sound effects. It ain't pretty, but it works.

Wiper · « **Reply #3 on:** 09 Sep 2002, 21:11:31 »

hmm, masking the RadioMsgs as condition of player side/name should provide a (painful of course) solution for the radio menu specific for each side !

What remains unsolved for me comes with the fact of the global function of triggers:
If one side uses Radio Alpha it is executed on all other (human controlled) sides .
The only way around i see is to give each side his exclusive channels, i.e. EAST: 1,3,5 - WEST: 2,4,6

any other ideas for this ?

-

For the shell sound problem in MP I went back to the
good old "MachineGun SetPos / Setdammage 1" method

Not the most fency arty sounds (especially when using BIS default sounds) but can be heared on all sides! It also provides a more "realistic" lethal radius than the default HEATs so no need for another addon..

Wondering that even customized SFX sounds don't work for MP missions.

Anyway,
thanks for your replys

Wiper

sussmori · « **Reply #4 on:** 10 Sep 2002, 04:18:34 »

Hi,

Invasion 1944 already has MP artillery that works perfectly via radio. With whistling shells and explosion sounds too.

It's possible assuming you have a very solid knowledge of multi-threaded programming and the associated synchronization issues. Knowing the OFP MP quirks also helps ;D

I'm sure Backoff could help you out with this

Sui · « **Reply #5 on:** 10 Sep 2002, 08:02:05 »

Quote from: Wiper on 09 Sep 2002, 21:11:31

What remains unsolved for me comes with the fact of the global function of triggers:
If one side uses Radio Alpha it is executed on all other (human controlled) sides .
The only way around i see is to give each side his exclusive channels, i.e. EAST: 1,3,5 - WEST: 2,4,6

any other ideas for this ?

There's almost always a way, laddie ;D

East Radio Trigger

Radius: 0,0
Condition: Radio Alpha
Conditon field: this and (side player == east)
OnActivation field: [blah] exec "Eastarty.sqs"

West Radio Trigger

Radius: 0,0
Condition: Radio Alpha
Conditon field: this and (side player == west)
OnActivation field: [blah] exec "Westarty.sqs"

Those two triggers both use radio alpha, but depend on the side of the player for activation...
You could also use a condition line like:

this and (player == aP3)

To make Radio Alpha different depending on the specific player that activates it if you so desire... the sky is the limit...

However one thing to remember is that you may need to do some cunning things to get scripts activating on all computers, or just on the clients depending on how you need to work it

Good Luck

sussmori · « **Reply #6 on:** 10 Sep 2002, 12:15:01 »

Sui,

Are you sure this will work?
It seems to me if a player on the opposite side activates the radio then on your local machine the condition will be true and it runs erronously?

Eg. west player activates the alpha channel

You, the east player, will get alpha channel activated (due to OFP MP)

thus the 'this' part of alpha trigger (on your computer) becomes true
and since this is on your computer 'side == EAST' will be true and thus your radio alpha will run (when it's not supposed to)

Wiper · « **Reply #7 on:** 11 Sep 2002, 02:44:28 »

yes sussmori,
that is the problem

Quote

East Radio Trigger
Radius: 0,0
Condition: Radio Alpha
Conditon field: this and (side player == east)
OnActivation field: [blah] exec "Eastarty.sqs"

West Radio Trigger

Radius: 0,0
Condition: Radio Alpha
Conditon field: this and (side player == west)
OnActivation field: [blah] exec "Westarty.sqs"

Sui,
if the West player for example calls radio alpha both scripts "eastarty.sqs" AND "westarty.sqs" are launched simultanously - the appropriate script for each side of course but...lol...
..imagine the surprised East player whose arty will be firing without his command ;D

thats the point

same results with the <player==name> condition since the whole thing i guess is not simply a detection issue (who calls) rather than an executing issue (on which side is it supposed to execute)

thx anyway !

btw sussmori, thanks for the tip with invasion 1944.
will take a closer look into
as u might imagine i'm very interested in scripting details like above.
is it possible to get some insde view to the scripts of the project if downloading ?

no not a very solid multithreading knowledge here.
wrote tons of scripts over the last year but most concerning random/dynamic AI movements/behaviour and environments/placements

Sui · « **Reply #8 on:** 11 Sep 2002, 04:16:47 »

So that's how it works huh?

When a radio code is activated it is transmitted as a publicvariable?

Puts a bit of a crink in my method then doesn't it ;D

CosmicEvo · « **Reply #9 on:** 04 Oct 2002, 04:49:59 »

Alright,
Other than this really is too much of a pain in the butt, is it fesible ( I would test but am stuck without MP ability at the moment ) for you to create an action menu on a player that activates the radio commands only on his computer for a short period of time, say 10 secs. and then when the radio is called it will only run on his comp. Or will it still activate the Radio script on all machines? Can I say this is a pain in the butt too many times? anyway, If someone tests this let me know the outcome, I would like to NOT have everything I use in a MP game need to constantly display in the action menu...

Cosmic Evolution

CosmicEvo · « **Reply #10 on:** 05 Oct 2002, 03:19:37 »

... Oh well... Can this be one of the most difficult things to come across in scripting this game, PLEASE...

I think I've bypassed it though, here's what you do....

First,

1. No players can be in the same group....

2. Each playable unit you create, you'll need to make a variable for that holds its group (ie. put "Player1=group this" in it's init field).

3. Make one variable(or two if you want each side to be independently able to use the radio calls) that tells which player is using the radio (I'll call this WP?)

4. Create a script that checks the players group versus the variables for each playable unit, and sets the variable WP? to a number corresponding to the unit that called it, and publicVariable "WP?"... This script should pause for a few seconds to give the player time to call the radio then reset the variable to 0.

5. At the beginning of the Radio script, run the same check that the other script uses, but also check to see if the WP? variable is corresponding to this unit also, If they do, than it's this unit that called on the radio. Just make everyone else exit. Now the Radio script is running only on the callers computer.

6. Go get yourself something strong to drink and STOP using your computer for the evening.

Soooooo.... In answer to your question, YES, the Radio is worthless in MP missions.... Useless you REALLY want to use it... And hey, This could always not work too, I haven't tested it very extensively yet... Logic never seems to hold up well to game programmers whims, does it?

#####

I've attached some scripts I use in an upcoming map, called -= Strategy Wars =- That should be released sometime very soon, before the end of Oct. hopefully. They show how to use a radio call to bring a secondary group to your location for support. (At least thats what it's supposed to do

You all should keep an eye out for it's release. I think alot of you might like what it's capable of...

Cosmic Evolution

P.S. Feel free to use these scripts to get you started if you'd like......

sussmori · « **Reply #11 on:** 05 Oct 2002, 04:05:04 »

It's not completely worthless. For exaple in Invasion1944, we use channels 1-4 for US commander and 5-8 for German commander in a MP game for calling arty.