News comment: New initiative (the M4 thing)

[LCD]

didnt he talk bout addons

in the ofp community is the emergence of too many d**n addons that are pretty much the same

LCD OUT

[Sefe]

Arrouan, do you think when I ask you not to abuse other threads for your discussions, the adequate reaction is to go even deeper into that discussion? It's not you who defines what a topic is about but the one who started the thread. This thread isn not about efficiency, not about scripting, it's about addons. Plain and simple.

I suggest that you heed to a moderator's decision in the future. We're approachble, so if you have questions, feel free to ask. But there is a reasoning behind our actions and you shouldn't ignore them lightly.

Thank you.

[Baphomet]

(...regarding various ammo types)
Well... hm. Honestly. I am of the mind that so long as I can take something and make my own adjustments to it without laying claim to it as my own or distributing it without permission. I'll go ahead and do that.

If you want something done the right way. You best do it yourself as I always say. Hell. I'll integrate a common ammo sharing system for all the addons that I play that might need it. So long as I can get my evil mitts on their .cpp.

If I can't then I might just make my own cpp and use the resources. I see nothing wrong with that so long as I don't distribute. OFP is all about me having fun playing the game the way -I- want to. The day that becomes impossible is the day I stop playing ofp.

That's another thing... Goddamned now there are at least three: to my knowledge, Mig 29 addons. One recently released by Vit. Now I don't begrudge Vit the commendation for such a nice looking addon with interesting features... but. Dammit. It's just a runaway train this addon redundancy thing is.

[Wolfrug]

Exhibit A: The BAS Ranger/Delta addon, otherwise in all manners of speaking an excellently well done piece of work. But the unsilenced M4's and the silenced M4's have different magazines (M4 Mag and M4S Mag).   Considering there already IS an M4 mag available in the original game... *sigh*

Seriously, these kinds of things are starting to grow on me. The AK47 CZ and the AK47 use the same mag, the AK74 and the AK74SU use the same mag. The M16/M203 and the bloody AK74 grenade launchers use the same grenades!

Exhibit B: UCE's superior Russian Federation troops. Their weapons are re-skinned, and I can cope with that. IMHO the original AK's were fugly anyway. They use the same sound as the original guns (probably to save space). But they've got their own unique magazines, the only difference when you look at them in-game is that the original magazines are AK74 Mags while UCE's are AK-74 Mags.

  Oh well. I'm just thinking aloud here. All I'm saying is that it'd simply be easier for us to actually use these addons in missions (as they should be) if we could for instance add a fancy new weapon to a Resistance soldier without having to unPBO the addon and go digging in some .cpp files to find the name of the gun.  

/Rant :toocool:

Wolfrug out.

[Messiah]

rant do he alot. unhappy be he magazines with.

 

[Eviscerator]

Exhibit A: The BAS Ranger/Delta addon, otherwise in all manners of speaking an excellently well done piece of work. But the unsilenced M4's and the silenced M4's have different magazines (M4 Mag and M4S Mag).   Considering there already IS an M4 mag available in the original game... *sigh*

There is not already an M4 mag ingame, there is an XM-177E2 magazine, if we had used that magazine it would say "XM-177E2 Single" or "XM-177E2 Auto" when using an M4A1 (Despite looking similar they are different weapons), you also can not fit a silenced weapon with a normal magazine because it wont be silenced, the ammuniton and sound information are in the magazine, so not only would it sound like a normal weapon, the ai wouldnt regard it as silenced either, also, most ammuntion used in silenced weapons is subsonic ammunition, otherwise it is not silenced, just muffled, as the bullet will still have the supersonic 'Crack' as it leaves the barrel. So realisticly you wouldnt use unsilenced ammunition in a silenced rifle, or silenced ammunition in a normal rifle.

What JAM is doing is creating magazines that have better sounds, and are suitable for any weapon of the same caliber, that uses the same ammunition (ie non silenced), we will also be creating high dispersion versions (as seen in the nam pack) of every magazine included, the one problem we have faced however is that there will no longer be "M4 Single" or "M4 Auto", as this information is in the magazine, not the weapon itself, so we will either have to change it to "Rifle Single" or "5.56x45mm Single" so that it will be able to be used in all the weapons that realisticly can use that magazine without having "M4 Auto" in the top left corner when firing an SA-80. It will however still say, for example, "Pick up SA-80", or "Weapon SA-80"

There are many flaws with the way BIS made the ammunition and magazine/weapons cpp's, the way JAM will do it is the easiest way to deal with them, also, with a hell of a lot of addon makers ready to be JAM compliant you wont have to dig through pbo's looking for various classnames for magazines, you will only need to have the JAM readme/ammunition list that will come with the addon.

[Sefe]

Dammit. It's just a runaway train this addon redundancy thing is.

What do you want to do? Tell the addon makes which addons they should produce? He, everyone is free to do the addons he wants and I'll be the last one to tell anyone not to produce the 150th version of a Blackhawk, Mig 29 or whatever. Let the people make the addons they feel like and you decide which ones are worth being put in your addons directiory.

[Tomb]

...Let the people make the addons they feel like and you decide which ones are worth being put in your addons directiory.

....   the BIS trabi?!   ;D

j/k.    A good thing about discussing all this is that we get to know what ppl want.
What folks do back home is their own thing; I have balanced several weapons to fit my fave mags, and this is prolly the best compromise ppl like old ran(t/d)y wolfrug wanna see: updates of addons (or at least future addons) with shared mags/original BIS mags!  

I support this idea but not at all costs; sometimes, some addon makers really manage to put together a really well tweaked "ammo" which is so good that you can actually notice the difference ingame.  
And then we have the archie-bartchie about who make the best 'cfgAmmo' for this & that weapon   ;D

I dare not think about it, but its a nice dream to imagine such new 'standard ammo' stuff.

As for reskinned-only weapons, that period is over I think, now that we have O2.
And thus: no need to discuss UCE ammo or similar old stuff (age matters).

[Skaven]

Guys I really see no point in this discussion, the JAM project is being made thinking on the gameplay and on the mission makers.
To me it makes no sense in for example using our Rangers in a mission with another addon maker's Seals and if I need ammo and I find some from a dead Seal I won't be able to catch it cause they are different, the only option is swapping weapons.  :-\
Our intentions as usual are to make our game as real as possible, to me it's real to have all M4s using the same Mags for all addons isn't it for you  

Ofcourse and as stated we can't tell everyone hey the M4 mags are here so you must use them, no no , no way, people are free to choose we never ever intendend to take freedom of choice but instead we give an alternative a new choice, wich basically represents to have all of our West and East addons sharing the same mags, how can this be bad? This can't be bad, it's purely simple an option, or you take it or you don't, if you ask me I take it  

[Tomb]

[size=12]Denmark - Luxembourg : 2-0[/size]

(so far, 8:15 GMT)

 
 
 
 
 
 
 











Good point about the realism. sounds fair to fundamentalists like me   ;D

[Wolfrug]

Eviscerator - I stand corrected, as usual. :toocool: Damn I gotta try some addon-editing one of these days, just to see what the fuss is all about. Even ol' bmoT there had a go at it. Maybe I'd see your pain better then. So the sound and name info is all in the magazine? Right. JAM seems like the real deal then, I'll be damned sure to get it when it's ready. In the meantime I'll see what this "Addon" thing is all about...

Bah. Enough trouble trying to catch up with this whole "Resistance" bullcrap...  :beat:

...  

Wolfrug out.

[Artak]

I gotta try some addon-editing one of these days, just to see what the fuss is all about.

Bro, that makes two of us, but I've adapted the old saying "you can't teach old dog new tricks" and so I've made a deal with myself to learn as much about version 1.0 and forget this addon bullshit and resistancecrap  ;D

[Tomb]

lol, wolfrugster: "BMOT"   ;D you recall that!

well, to stay on top'

One thing I'm starting to get annoyed about in the ofp community is the emergence of too many d**n addons that are pretty much the same. I really don't understand why every mod or pack must create the exact same weapon when the community should be open enough that a mod team could ask someone who's made a decent version of the gun already to use that...

:thumbsup: I think this pretty much sums up the 'wassups' in this tread. And rumor goes that BAS and similar leading addon-teams will make some sort of deal about sharing mags/weapons in future addons.   And if it sticks, if this deal is on, then mission making will be alot easier very soon!  

I can only support this idea 100% - provided the "new order" -weapons are that cool. :toocool: