(Review Completed) [SP] Abandoned Armies

[XCess]

Well, I've been playing the mission since my last post, nearly 4 hours ago  . My first thoughts. Wow!  

Got into Vigny and tried shooting through the windows at a ruskie, missed so they jumped around a bit.  Moved to my left a lil and killed him. Another ruskie ran off towards the crevace and i put a few holes in his back.. not sure what happened to the american, could have killed him but as I say, that was 4 hours ago.Spoke to Tatyana, she died, popped her killer with the pistol.
Ran over to grab his M16 and ended up takin down a night equipped officer before I jumped in the jeep, so I took his binocs, NVG and gun before driving off to the lodge.

Kept everyone with the weapons they had, except the chick who i lumbered with the Kozliceand I gave myself the hunting rifle. Then we all loaded up into the truck and I let 2 drive us to the first batch of civilians. Parked up at the bottom of the hill and scouted the area myself, spoke to whoever and had the truck pick us all up.
Second group of civvies I dealt with in the same way.
One the way to the third group we encountered a MG jeep patrol near Larche, I decided to let 2 keep driving and see if they'd respond. The jeeps opened far just as we were passing them, so retry back to the lodge with the second group of civvies. This time i drove the truck personally and just drove due west to the shed they're hiding in.
On the way back is where I started to fall in love.
Driving across the road i saw the convoy. Only noticed two vehicles at this point: a 5t and a Bradley. With a truck full of Civvies and no AT weapons I decided to run. This meant dodging the patrol by driving between the bradley and 5t... very nearly hit the Bradley but just got past and kept my life thanks to the fog.
Finished offloading civvies around 8am gametime i think.

Now for some weapons.
I took with me 3 mags in the hunting rifle and a few nade's. Drove south west at full speed in the jeep until I ran into a fuel depot and Ural. Thought hmm, so I drove up to some bushes and crawled back to take a look. Turned out I was in Dourdan, so i took some cover in the bushes near the south fuel station and watched a group move scarily close to me.
They were grouped up pretty nicely. Not entierly sure on the numbers but I I noticed they were split into two hunched groups. So.. one grenade to my left, one grenade to my right and a sniper round for the dude with the m60.
Ofcourse.. I had to wait for the convoy to go past again.

Started loading their weapns into the Ural when I noticed someone coming from the East. Jumped back into my bush.
Ruskiwe with an At4 stopped right next to me while the rest of the group (not so hunched) went into the town.
Put a couple of rounds into the At4 soldier which got the attention of the rest of his squad. They movedf into position for some more nads  ;D One survivor taken down with the m16 id picked up before contact with the squad.

Started loading more weapons into the Ural and I thought I heard the Jeeps. Back into my bush. Rather than Jeeps  it turned out to be a t80, what looked like a t72 and i think an m113. They seem to have come to check the gunfire as they turned back when all they found were corpses.

Finished loading up my truck and saved (didn't want to loose such a good loot, in total I had 4-5 AT Weapons, 2-3 M60s, 2 Stingers and a hell of a lot of long arms and nades. Drove to the west and encountered a patrol who destroyed me with a LAW. back to retry.. took the road up towards... Arudy then cut off to the road to Larche and moved southwest to the lodge. Played with the idea of takin down either the cobra or hind, changed my mind ad spent half an hour assigning my squad weapons.

Experience a lot of lag(though I think thats clearing up a bit), but tbh I didn't really care. One lag reduction idea is to send the civs to actual lodge instead of the ruin and deleteVehicle them once they're nearby.. every unit counts when it comes to lag.

I'm scared to go back into it now for fear of my life being sucked away  

**edit**
I swear I've missed a million things out. One thing for sure THobson, this is definately an experience... A game has never made feel so proud after I got that loot back to the lodge. Again. WOW! I can't say enough... I'm in shock..

off to play some more  ;D

[macguba]

You mad fool - leave the woman in.    All you need to do is add a sound file (and ok just one more trigger) so that she screams "Get away from me!   All of you get away from me!" as she runs away.

Saint Louis was empty after I had both started the war and attacked the airfield (although that attack consisted simply of shooting one M2 gunner from some distance) so it didn't feel odd.

Part of the problem with acting is getting the level right - under acting and overacting are both bad.    Because this is only voice you have no facial expresssions to help you which makes it doubly hard.

I was sure at least some of the snipers in unimpossible had disableAI or something ... maybe not.   Ah wait, I'm thinking of the ones in towers round the Old Base, not just the ones on the hillside.    I don't know if the binocs actually help them:  NVGs are obviously necessary in case the mission makes it to nighttime.     I used probability because uncertainty became an axiom of the design.   Although the mission became so big that chance of somebody playing it twice is remote, and if they did they wouldn't remember.    

I hope my stories don't put anyone off.   I have in the past had comments suggesting that it is necessary to write a lot to be a beta tester, but this is simply not true.    Two sentences can be very valuable.

I'm not convinced you need named, dynamic markers to show who controls where.  When I made the comment I was thinking of something fairly vague and based on the situation at the start of the mission - as if you had marked up your map before leaving to find your Uncle.

I don't know how many of them are named but I have noticed scope for reducing the number of static objects.    When unimpossible got too big I was able to halve the number of objects:  I did have to lose one or two minor sites, which was a great disappointment, but at many others, by means of very careful placement and much testing, to reduce the number of objects a lot while keeping the "feel" right.   This is partly why I got a few compliments on the atmosphere - I had worked really hard on creating locations that looked and felt real with very few objects allowed.

It's interesting that most people seem to have gone wandering around after doing the civvies.     It seemed to me that La Trinite was your best bet since it was bound to have weapons lying around that you could get without having to fight anybody, and also you can start the war.   I did deliberately go there because others were not, but it is how I would have fought away.   Not sure what I would have done after establishing my little base:   I only headed straight for the airfield to be consistent with going for the jugular.

Anyway, good luck on placating the missus.

[THobson]

@XCess

I am totally thrilled ;D.  It is a real pleasure to know so much of it is coming together the way I wanted and that others feel the same way as I do about it.  I made the point earlier that I have some difficulty in trying different ways to play a mission once I have found one I liked - so it is good to hear your story.

t80, what looked like a t72 and i think an m113.

Quite right.  The m113 is a vulcan, deadly things

@macguba

(the fires should all go out when it's light enough)

I did have that in mind but it means they each need to have a name!.  I will follow your advice and get it all working the way I want it and then start losing things to get rid of the bug and reduce lag.

@all
It is a little early. and it may be a bit presumptious to think that some of you might finish the mission before getting bored, but if you do there is something at the end I would welcome your opinion on.  For you to see what I want you to see, one or more of the following conditions need to be true when the last loon is killed:
- at least two of your team need to be alive and in a vehicle
- at least one of your team needs to be alive and not in a vehicle
- at least one of your team needs to have been killed while in a vehicle
- at least one of your team needs to have been killed while not in a vehicle

If you can't get all these conditions that is fine, I mention it just in case you have the chance to set up any of these conditions.

[THobson]

You mad fool - leave the woman in.    All you need to do is add a sound file (and ok just one more trigger) so that she screams "Get away from me!  All of you get away from me!" as she runs away.

Lol.  Okay.  I will lose her man friend though.

I have just had another look at Un-Impossible.  You remembered correclty.  The snipers in the tower at the top of the hill had AI "move" and AI "target" disabled.  Why disable "target"?

[XCess]

I am totally thrilled .

No more than me.. I'm in awe!! I had to literally pull myself out of my flat to stop playing this after my failed expidition to La Trinite.. next time I'll let the patrol return to the North and set up and ambush... and wait.
One thing that's been really annoying me is the woman in my group speakin like a dude on the radio.. but i loved the voice acting for her and the resistance soldier you meet at the lodge.. reminded me of 'Black & White'.

All I need now is some of those mines and a druganov and I'm set ;D
Now.. what else was I gonna say... something surely, all I can think right now is wow lol  ;D

**edit**
oh yeah.. Larche seems to be empty a lot and the fires seemed to turn off for me, but I disabled a few things in video so that could be why...

[macguba]

Just finished my last post while you were posting.

Take your point about the fires.   If triggers aren't a problem you could perhaps have a trigger over each one

Area:    4x4
Activation:   east present
Condition:   this and daytime > 7.5
On activation:   thislist select 0 do fire animation:   this nearestobject fireplace inflame false

Syntax not there of course but you get the idea.   Dunno if it will work but it might help.   And of course you're only trading smoke for triggers which might not help anyway, although having the fires out would look better.

Its not presumptious to think somebody might finish the mission.    As long as you have two loons left at the end it should be possible to set up those conditions if you have a decent savegame.    Do you get any more loons for your squad or is that it?    Normally I wouldn't ask to avoid spoiling the surprise but if its important its helpful to know.

Allow me to quote General Barron's Comment from the online comref, on the topic of disableAI.    If you have disableAI the doStop is probably redundant.

The "TARGET" section of the AI is likely different than what you would think. Normally, when an AI group is standing still and sees an enemy, the group will break formation and start moving towards the enemy. If you disable the "TARGET" AI, then the AI units will stay where they are at.

Even if you disable the "MOVE" AI, the units will still move out to attack the enemy, unless you disable the "TARGET" AI.

Disabling both these AI sections is useful when placing units in defensive positions. This way, you can have them stay behind their cover, and not run out into the open.

Don't waste time to make the woman in your group speak with a higher voice, I've tryed them all at all pitches and they all sound shite.    Sadly you have to live with it or maybe do something really funky deep inside the game engine.

[XCess]

Yeah the voice is just a minor annoyance realy.. pitch shifting voices usually gives an effect more like alvin from the chipmunks than a feminine tone I've noticed (not in OFP though.. haven't played much with voice pitches)

Also, I've noticed my squad won't follow me, they follow other 3 or 6 when i tell them to fall in. I've got stop written all over my unit icon in big letters so I'd guess this is the problem. This was one of the reasons I was killed by the north patrol.. as well as firing my LAW late. I spent so much time F**kin around with em I didn't notice three russians run right up to me.

[THobson]

Don't waste time to make the woman in your group speak with a higher voice,

Actually I already have!  I went through all the voices and a whole range of pitches.  I made a little missionette to do it, In the same way I have checked all the faces and all the expressions.  If some one needs a missionette that shows all this I have one.

I've tryed them all at all pitches and they all sound sh*te.

I agree.  What I chose (voice = "Boris" pitch = 1.1) sounded quite feminine in comparison with the alternatives, but in isolaton I agree it sounds crap.

Do you get any more loons for your squad or is that it?

You have all you are going to get I am afraid.

On the fires: The first priority is that they look right.  Thanks for the idea of the trigger.

I haven't got the hang of all of these yet but does:  :tomato: mean that I am blushing?  How could I ask a question that is so easily answered from the comref.  I thought I had got beyond that!  Thanks.

[THobson]

Also, I've noticed my squad won't follow me, they follow other 3 or 6 when i tell them to fall in.

It sounds like though you are the group leader you are not the formation leader.  I have no idea how this happened.  I noticed formLeader in comref.  It tells you who the formation leader is, but I have not found any way to chane it.

[XCess]

I don't see any reason for me to not be formation leader,. I juse seem to be under a stop command (waypoint or script?)
Anyone else experienced this?

[THobson]

The player has no waypoints and I certainly have not deliberately scripted this  I have never seen this before.  Is it still playable?

EDIT:
@macguba

It seemed to me that La Trinite was your best bet

I am begining to wonder if having the treasure trove at 3 is too much of a spoiler.  SEAL84 and XCess seem to have had great fun scavaging for weapons.

Even non-dynamic markers need a name.  Anyway I will put all in what I want and then pull out what is necessary.

Not knowing about the problem at the start I have given names to objects that I need not have done.  A large spring clean should do the trick.

She is placated thanks.

[XCess]

Yeah the mission's still playable but I'll just use my squad for back up from now on. I'll play around with the order menu to see if I accidentally did it myself.. Never happened before though. Units also radio in ready when they disembark a vehicle instead of joining formation with me as usual.

[macguba]

@ Xcess
I have had the problem you are experiencing.   The game is still totally playable, but you have to think on your feet as far formations and the position of your loons is concerned.   It just means that you are in a different place in the formation from the one you are used to.    You still issue the orders.

It is part of the game engine that this is supposed to be possible when the mission designer wants it to occur.  I don't know how it happens while playing, except that it appears to be a bug.   I associate it with issuing a lot of orders at once and getting in and out of vehicles.   If you can find a quiet spot and a lorry try getting in and out a few times, selecting the whole group using the `key to issue the order.   That's roughly how I got out of it.

@ Thobson
I wouldn't say the trove at 3 is a spoiler.  It is a legitimate way of playing themissions and expoiting it is not easy because there isn't much time between convoys.     Partly because I didn't get a proper run at it due to interuptions, it took me several attempts.    In the end what actually happened was that I went into the town, got proper long weapons for everybody, drove three vehicles to just outside the town and then legged it as the next convoy arrived.    The wealth of riches and density of ammo crates actually slows things down when it comes to rearming.    There's no problem about having a such a trove given that it is in a dangerous spot.    If I was to change anything it would be to reduce the number of crates - there are more than you need, even to create the impression of a big dump.

If you have made missionette with faces and voices I suggest you tart it up slightly and submit it to the Ed Depot.  My investigation was more ad-hoc.

The correct smily for asking a question that could be answered by the comref is  .    Possibly followed by  . Not that I think that it applies in this case, because its a slightly obscure command and such things are hard to find when you don't know what you are looking for.

 :tomato: is more of a jocular "you plonker":  because of the movement in it, and implication that there is a thrower as well as a throwee, it is not really a self-referencing smily in the way that most of them are.    In other words, in this context it would have been used by me rather than you.

me - "disableAI target?   Haven't you looked up the online comref??  :tomato:"

you - "oops  "

You wouldn't use it on somebody you didn't know very well, at least not without a  ;D to show you were having a laugh.

[djackl]

Also, I've noticed my squad won't follow me, they follow other 3 or 6 when i tell them to fall in. I've got stop written all over my unit icon in big letters so I'd guess this is the problem. This was one of the reasons I was killed by the north patrol.. as well as firing my LAW late. I spent so much time F**kin around with em I didn't notice three russians run right up to me.

Happens to me too, i once put some men into a bmp, told them to return to formation after giving them a move order somewhere (realising there was a convoy in front of them) but they kept going and got destroyed.

[XCess]

Thanks for the tip Macca, I'll try it after I've had some food.
Great side track to the topic btw   grammatical use of smilies