(Review Completed) [SP] Last Tango In Bagango

[johnnyboy]

@LCD:  I have alot of feedback now, and plan to fix and release a new version.  How about if you wait until next weekend to beta test the new version.  I'm guessing it takes 30 minutes to an hour.

@Shark:  Thanks for the test, will address your pionts after Cheetah's below...

@101: You are observant!  You saw the clue!  Thanks for the cool pics.  Its a bit of spoiler now though...

@cheetah:  My earlier reply got cut off...Once again, thanks for the thorough review.

Intro: In the beginning there's a bit of lag

What can cause lag in an intro?  Is the engine loading the main mission at the same time?  Since the intro doesn't have too many units and waypoints, I'm not sure why this would be...

probably pretty hard to get the guy in the latrine with his eyes above the door and the Los pantalos to get armed and walk through the building.

Definitely.  That's where alot of my time went.

I'd like to see other ranks. ... I noticed that there is no medic in my squad, would've liked a medikit script or medic.

I didn't pay attention to ranks, will fix.  I think I'll add the medkit script shark is using in Tiptoe.  I didn't want a regular soldier medic with the especas (wish BIS would give us an especas medic).

Text accompanying the voices are a must however.

Glad you liked the farmhouse encounter, its the heart and soul of this mission.  Adding text for voices is now my highest priority...especially for my non-English speaking friends (and everybody else who has to struggle with my cheesy voice acting).

I had to look for the 2nd ammo cache and the fuel myself.

Intel available dependent on your farmhouse encounter results.  You either get zero, one, or two of the objective locations identified.  You always have to find the 3rd on your own.

The after - ammo explosions are cool, but in my opinion the script lasts too long

I'll shorten it up a little.  They do lessen in intensity and frequency as time passes. 

Thanks Cheetah, hope to release new (possibly final version) in a week.

@Shark:  Thanks for the beta test bro!

shame about the music ...

I'll have to think about some cool music here.  Maybe Barry Manilow...

no weapon selection   

Yeah, I know.  I guess I need it for replayability.  Does weapon selection screw up soldiers having weapons added via init scripts?  Right now I have scripts running on squad members to add RPGs, nades and silenced pistols.

enjoyed  playing this   ...  however  i struggled  to hear  voice acting  at times ... maybe subtitles
nice   scripting throughout   and  unit placement  is spot on ...  nice ending  all  were ticked ...
found  the  gameplay  choppy at times  ... maybe lower the view distance

Will add subtitle text.  Thanks for the compliments.  I enjoy unit placement, and make an effort to not have "statue" guards.

Is view distance something I should control in mission?  I thought that was a player setting mostly.  This is a good idea, since this is a one-town CQB mission, there is no real need for long view distance.

Thanks again to all for the feedback!!!!

Long live OFPEC!!!!

[mathias_eichinger]

Hi Johnnyboy!

I found your mission very entertaining and very well scripted.

Overview

Funny pic of a guy spying in a latrine, great idea!

Briefing

Very informative and funny to read, told the story further.

Intro

A very well scripted piece of camerawork (Cojon entering the latrine, the Pantalones arming themselves...).

Mission

Met some enemies behind the truck at Cojone's farm but I managed to kill them and Cojon survived the firefight injured. Great conversation with Cojon afterwards, the voice acting is really good!
I managed to get to the first arms cache with no losses and there I picked up the medic M113 to keep us safe from bullets. Drove that thing like mad trough Bagango, rolling over any enemy opposition. I arrived at the fuel cache and I let my squad disembark to provide cover (the location being a bit more exposed than the courtyard. Sadly, I lost all me men. After I few retries I was able to get away from there without being RPGed. While driving around I noticed the second arms cache and I blew it up, ran towards my APC, was shot at and hit, but I could get in right in time. Then I drove in a wide arc towards the extraction point, got stuck in some bushes and finished the rest of my journey on foot.

Conclusion

Mission with a great hilarious humor touch, excellent voice acting and scripting, much action, you even scripted secondary explosions from the caches (or it could have been battle between the warring factions). The civilians were running around a bit cluelessly but I think that is what civilians in ArmA do...they provided many adversaries tough. I doubt if I could have beaten the mission without my little "cheating". So it is a great mission with excellent story and absolutely recommendable.

Keep up the good work!

Mathias 

[johnnyboy]

Matthias, thanks alot for the praise, and your time testing the mission.   I really appreciate it.  Yes, the secondary explosions were scripted.

I never thought of using the M113 that way (smart idea on your part), so I may decide to lock it.  Will think about it.

One thing I did notice about the M113 is that the enemy does not shoot you while you are in it.

Regarding stupid ARMA civilians, except for using a civilian addon like Bardosy suggested, I can't make them behave any better.

I'm currently modifying the mission per earlier feedback (subtitles, first aid, adding outtro, etc.), and will be posting a new semi-final version in 3 or 4 days.  I then hope to get one or two more beta tests from you folks to make sure I didn't add some crazy bug to it...then I it will be ready for formal review.

Unfortunately, I started a new job, so don't have as much time for this...

[101]

@101: You are observant!  You saw the clue!  Thanks for the cool pics.  Its a bit of spoiler now though... Wink

Sorry, I did not want to tell the punchline...

[johnnyboy]

Patch 1.08 caused some problems in this mission:

1. Faces changed.
2. Secondary Explosion script no longer works.
3. Cutscenes slightly off because units arrive earlier or later than camera expects them too (this is REALLY annoying, as it is very time consuming to get camera placement aligned with unit movement...).

There may be more patch related problems, as I have only tested with patch for about 15 minutes.

I am working on improving this mission anyway, so will fix all the above, and hopefully be out with new version within a week.  Including a fun Outro.

[bardosy]

I patched my ArmA to 1.08 and I think it was a bad decision... I must spent to my weekend to reintall 1.05.
I tested my mission and they works fine, but the ArmA... It became VERY laggy (15-20 sec frozen, 1 sec gameplay...etc).

[bardosy]

Unbelievable! I captured it yesterday... This is 1.08.

[johnnyboy]

Wow, Bardosy, that is not good...

I actually have no new performance problems.  It might even be performing a little better for me.

Have you tried resetting all your Video settings?  Maybe search the BIS boards for someone else with a similar problem who fixed it somehow?

By the way, my secondary explosion scripts started working again after I removed some addons.  So now I have only 2 known problems with Tango:

1. New faces (not really a problem, I will pick a new one, and then redo my mission .jpg pictures).
2. Units arriving early or late to cutscenes.  This is time consuming work, and does not give me confidence for the future.  Will we have to re-work cutscenes for old missions every time a patch comes out?

[bardosy]

Hello johnnyboy!

I tried to set low everything and restart arma and set up normal again, but the problem is still exists.
Not this video... It's the worst state, when everything became bad. But the whole game is instable...

I tried the begining of Last Tango and I noticed only one problem in the intro, when El Cojon arrive with the tractor and the camera zoom not to El Cojon, but next to him.

I'm really happy to you could fix the secondary exposition, because I love it and if you publish it, I will use it...

[firecontrol]

Not sure if you still want feedback for this... but here goes.

Overview
I LOVE that picture... hahaha. Very nice overview!

Briefing

The briefing is informative, and to the point. Notes section does a good job of differentiating civvies. I did get a small error here though, not sure if it's my game or the mission: http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v462/FireControl/arma2007-07-0920-30-01-76.jpg   I actually got that error on any loading of savegames, too.

Intro

Very funny! I like the way you bend the AI to your will... good scripting. Overall a great intro.


Mission

Good custom voices, love the humor. "They search our houses but not under our tractor." LOL. Found that tricky RACS guy in the outhouse as well, thanks to a previous post.
I placed all but one of my sabotuers in a semi-circle around the Northeast part of town as me and my buddy
went in to destroy the objectives. This was fortunate, as they provided great overwatch, even sending a couple RPGs into some enemy vehicles that came in.  Very nice. Near the end, El Cojon went off on his own and wouldn't respond to me... he'd say "roger" but wouldn't move. I could hear him speaking very faintly there near the end, but couldn't make out what he was saying. Found the last weapons cache... and drove over the guard with an M113... splat. The secondary explosions are kinda cool, but I think they go on too long. Very fun and action packed! There are enemies everywhere.. up and down! Love that sniper on the smokestack, btw.

Outro

None. Was looking forward to some more witty humor.

Summary

Excellent mission. I enjoyed playing it. Hope you get this thing finished and reviewed soon. Much fun!

[Gielovic]

Hi,
Although I'am not a very diehard player I finished this mission the first time i played it, here's my feedback

Overview
Looks nice, nice text and pic

Briefing

Nothing wrong here, a good briefing, I like the fact that you have to contact that guy (what was his name again:P) which extends your briefing, or at least add the new objectives. I had to find the third ammocache myself, i don't know if there is some civillian which is able to tell you where it's located during the mission, but that might be nice.

Intro

Nice intro, the tractor-boy drives a little bit to far. I didn't look at your script but perhaps it's easier to target the man and use the relativeposition. Overall a great Intro, especially the toilet-scene:D


Mission

The mission was continously exciting. In the beginning things aren't too difficult, although the first ammocache didn't blow up with only one satchel charge, a bit strange, the whole of the house has to go down. I liked the explosions afterwards (nice detail). As I said earlier somewhere else i lack leader skills so all my men where shot before i blew up the fuel-truck. Only El Cojon was still alive. I was lucky because i got shot while healing at the APC, so i switched to El Cojon and his MG. I was situated outside the town and had to run far. I think the problem is the fact that El Cojon is playable, it happens to me all the time that playable AI's just stop following my orders, or stop moving at all. Never mind, you won't be able to fix it as it's just another bug:(.
I searched through the whole of Bagango and killed almost every enemy i saw. The M113's are too lame, they don't even shoot at me while standing in their front +- 50 metres away (i was lucky:)). I picked up some AT and shot them both. Then i finally found the 3rd cache, after blowing up the MGtruck first. After a new (nice) explosion i went off and found one sniper in front of the 'smokestack' (if it's called like that tnx firecontrol;)). I guess he needs to be on top?.
Well the end wasn't difficult as i ran all the way to the forest. I was proud i made it out alive with almost no-one alive in the town.
Finished it with:
40 infantry kills
2 M113 killed
1 MG-truck killed
1 Refueltruck killed
and one own trooper

Outro

None, but there wasn't too much left in Bagango to show .

Summary

It's a nice mission which is very challenging. It's very nice you have to fight with civ's against civ's. The idea of the short and long pants is absolutely brilliant. The AI in the city sometimes sucks. Enemy's simply don't shoot at me which made it too easy at some points. However thats not something a mission maker is able to change. Perhaps you should try to use the urban-patrol script, as it makes enemy's react at your presence. (dunno if you use it already  )
I didn't see any bug which is great. The mission feels solid, without errors or any problems at all. Keep up the good work

[johnnyboy]

@firecontrol & Gielovic:  Gentlemen, thanks very much for testing this mission!  I greatly appreciate it.  I am working on the outro right now, and hope to submit for a final beta test within a few days.  Here's some specific responses to your feedback:

@firecontrol:   Thanks for all the praise!  I will address a few your points:

I did get a small error here (in briefing)

An addon sneaked in.  Fixed in upcoming release.

Nice intro, the tractor-boy drives a little bit to far.

This was an ARMA 1.08 problem.  AFter the patch, he drives too far (this is troubling, as how many people's cutscenes are disturbed by this patch?  It would suck to have to fix old missions and cutscenes after each patch).  Fixed in next release.  Arma 1.08 also changed the faces, and I don't like the face you saw for El Cojon.  Fixed for upcoming release.

I placed all but one of my sabotuers in a semi-circle around the Northeast part of town as me and my buddy
went in to destroy the objectives. This was fortunate, as they provided great overwatch, even sending a couple RPGs into some enemy vehicles that came in.

 

Smart tactic.  I never tried it that way.  I've played this a zillion times, and never finish with more one two squad mates left.  I'll have to try it that way.

El Cojon went off on his own and wouldn't respond to me... he'd say "roger" but wouldn't move. I could hear him speaking very faintly there near the end, but couldn't make out what he was saying.

Civilian AI blows.  They get stuck or take off sometimes.  He wasn't saying anything scripted, so you didn't miss anything.

and drove over the guard with an M113... splat

LOL.  Good move, but I think I need to lock the M113s, since the enemy AI never fires on them when you are in it.  What do you think?

secondary explosions are kinda cool, but I think they go on too long.

I'm shortnening that up a bit.  Thanks.

Outro - None. Sad Was looking forward to some more witty humor.

Outro in process as we speak.  It may be straying from "witty" to "twisted" though...

Thanks again and stay tuned!

@Gielovic:

Thanks for your time and praise sir!  I'll address a few of your points:

had to find the third ammocache myself, i don't know if there is some civillian which is able to tell you where it's located during the mission, but that might be nice.

War is dynamic and imperfect, so the intel you get is dependent on your actions.  You may get some or none depending...

the tractor-boy drives a little bit to far. I didn't look at your script but perhaps it's easier to target the man and use the relativeposition.

Before ARma patch 1.08, the camera shot was perfect.  Fixed in upcoming release.  Thanks for the advice.  I will look at how I fixed it, as targeting the man might prevent it from breaking again with a future Arma patch.

i switched to El Cojon and his MG. I was situated outside the town and had to run far. I think the problem is the fact that El Cojon is playable, it happens to me all the time that playable AI's just stop following my orders

In my new version, El Cojon is no longer playable (but he still joins the squad).  This doesn't really fix dumb Civ AI though, unfortunately.  Its just a limitation of ARMA that we have to live with.

The M113's are too lame, they don't even shoot at me while standing in their front +- 50 metres away (i was lucky:)).

Wow, that is very strange.  The M113s have always been very dangerous to me.  I will have to test this a little more.

found one sniper in front of the 'smokestack' (if it's called like that tnx firecontrol;)). I guess he needs to be on top?.

Thanks for finding this!  Did you save the game before this happened?  I bet a save game ruined his DISABLEAI "MOVE" command...  I know a way to fix this...so now its on my list to do!

Thanks again for your time and the thorough review.  This really helps!

[johnnyboy]

El Cojon hates to miss a party!!!  So a new improved version of Last Tango in Bagango is now available for a few more beta tests.

Change log:

-Added outro (hopefully equal in fun as intro)
-Added subtitles.
-Fixed marker addon error.
-Removed some objects to reduce intro lag.
-Trimmed overview.
-Changed civ waypoints to "seek and destroy" to make them more aggressive.
-Modified ranks.
-Reduced duration of secondary explosions.
-Added First Aid script.
-And more!!!

I thank all the Beta Testers thus far, for helping me find and fix flaws:

- Bardosy
- 101
- Cheetah
- Shark Attack
- mathias_eichinger
- firecontrol
- Gielovic

And a huge round of applause to ARMA's Best Voice Actress:  Mrs. Johnnyboy!

[Rellikki]

Package
The package is fine. It has everything it needs.

Overview
Nice overview. Short, good description of the mission and a fine picture.

Intro
Funny observation point. The intro was pretty exciting. Nice voice acting - interesting accent.

Briefing
The briefing is fine. Nice ideas with the religion stuff and those.

Mission
I moved to the house and eliminated the RACS soldiers. Only when I reached the waypoint, they "noticed" me, even
they were killed. Some RACS guy came out from the crapper... Well, that was unexcepted... We moved to the crossroads
in the west and took position from there. I planted a satchel on the first cache and sabotaged it. Had to circle
around from north for the fuel cache because there were too many explosions. One of my team mates got stuck near the
fuel cache, but luckily, there was the skoda next to it, so I could board him there and drive to safe distance. Then I sabotaged
it. We had some urban fight in the northern side of the village for a while. We kept advancing to the south, house
by house. I decided to check what's inside the yard between the big yellow houses and there it was, the second
weapons cache. I placed a satchel charge there from the crates and detonated it. Then we ran to the excraction
point and mission got completed.

Debriefing
Nothing wrong here. Completed the mission with 18 infantry kills... and one friendly one. + M113, hummer and a
fuel truck. Duration 22 minutes.

Outro
The outro was very funny. Nice ideas and camera tricks. How did Cojones get on top of the traffic pole?
I spotted one spelling mistake:
sargent -> sergeant

Summary
It was a pretty cool mission. I enjoyed the cutscenes, they were pretty well done. The voice actors were good too.
This would be a pretty good campaign too, in my opinion.

Project Beta Approved

[johnnyboy]

Relliki:  Thanks alot for the feedback, its much appreciated.  I'll fix that spelling mistake.

I was worried the mission is too hard, because I complete it only one out of every five tries.  You breezed through it in 22 minutes!  Note that it is replayable, because there is a pool objectives of 9 caches, that is randomly reduced to 3 at mission start up.  So the cache locations and cache defenders differ every time you play.


Nice voice acting - interesting accent.

The voice acting is all me, except the reporter is my wife.   I hope my cheesy spanish accent does not offend true spanish speakers.   No disrespect is intended, I am just a poor actor is all.